GOLIATH

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Waltzard 369

Long ago, there was a fearsome predator. D4vid. All of the big barriers were afraid of him, and his dreadful sling with three bullets. He could break any barrier, no matter how strong it was. And there was much sadness.

But then a hero, we know not who, slew the predator. He did something where now D4vid doesn't show up all the time, and instead there is this Paperclip guy. He is basically a wimp like Corroder.

And now the ancient beasts have wandered out to the pastures to graze once more.

Ice:

We have the big 9. 3 Fire, 3 Ice, 3 Hadrian's. Simple etf barriers that get bigger. These are your bread and butter. You should be advancing them almost every round.

Positional Ice:

Wendigo and Builder are our positionals, shielding the GOLIATH's bank wall from the rude fracters that want to go by. They are cheap to rez, expensive to break.

Upgrades:

Crisium Grid and Off The Grid do what they do. Everyone knows how that works.

Operations:

Beyond the vanquishing of D4vid, another change had come about that made the old dinos happier. Dedication Ceremony is a wonderful friend to this deck. Click for 3 advancement tokens, which will become 3 creds every time I commercialize? if I must.

Hedge and Beanstalk are basic early econ, they give you some money to tide the dino through the rough times before he gets his commercializations.

Localized Product Line and Reclamation Order. Together, these make your mid game into a heaven of playing Dedication Ceremonys and Commercializations endlessly. They fetch Criums and Off the Grids if they are needed.

Assets: Only the King is worthy to ride the GOLIATH.

Agendas: Typical Weyland suite. This deck is noteworthy in actually being able to pull off the Hollywood -> Atlas 4 round score out fairly regularly. If you have HQ 20+ creds to hit with a crisum and an off the Grid you can usually go for it.

Predators!

There are still lurking menaces

Dumbelfork: Weakened but far from ended, the great beast still hunts his prey. Against this enemy you must put wimpy barriers in front of your bank wall, you must strive to wear out his D4vid...in all probability you will lose.

Sneakdoor dudes: Vs blue that seem to be in the mindset, you need to build a third big wall. Put it on archives.

Political Operative: If someone runs you early and puts one of these down, it is bad. You will eventually lose an Off The Grid and an agenda to this, or you can try building a big tough remote to score out in.

This is the most successful BWBI deck I've ever built. Give it a try and it will do you good.

28 comments
1 Nov 2016 gozik

Best deck ever!

I made some tweeks and seems like it works)

1 Nov 2016 Waltzard

Ooh, what tweeks did you try? I was thinking of subbing in some Interns for Reclamation Order, try to afford Ash.

1 Nov 2016 Snake Eyes

Neat! Triple Dedication Ceremony recursion with Commercialization to capitalize off of it seems like a cool combo.

Thoughts on including a Executive Boot Camp or two to deal with Blackmail?

1 Nov 2016 Waltzard

A lot, actually. It is surprisingly common for them not to run advanced things, and then you can't use Dedication Ceremony. I really want a way to rez ice outside of the runner's turn.

But I'm very wedded to the "no remotes" concept. An EBC might get hit with Temüjin Contract and run into the floor. It is hard enough to block 3 servers decently, with one of them being the bank wall on HQ. Stretching to 4 feels like it'll let them in somewhere.

I've actually done some testing with the Amazon Industrial Zone . The main problem with it is getting it before I've already got the ice down. It basically needs to be opening hand, and then you need 3 copies and that is too many.

You actually have a decent game vs. Blackmail though. They have to Blackmail HQ to get the crisium, then do it again to get rid of OTG, and finally they might have to use another to get the agenda (if you put an ice wall or whatever in front of it.

More importantly, if they don't know how the deck works they might let you rez the centrals. A lot of blackmail decks I've seen use breakers for pressuring centrals and save their blackmails for remotes. These decks are in a lot of trouble vs. Off the Grid .

1 Nov 2016 Snake Eyes

Very well stated reply. I'll just mention though that if Executive Boot Camp gets hit by Temüjin Contract, you're laughing! Could use the paid ability to search for a Jackson Howard or another Executive Boot Camp to collapse the server. You probably just need the bootcamp to fire once since whatever you use it on will get up to God Strength in no time.

1 Nov 2016 Waltzard

Good point. Maybe I'll give ebc a try, change it out for Beanstalks.

1 Nov 2016 gozik

I add 2 lotus field, power shutdown to lock yog nre players, also swap agenda suit to 3 food + 2pointers. Also add 3rd off the grid. You can play reclamation order into off the grid and stack them in remote. Rez one by one if runner make another succesful run on HQ.

My version here netrunnerdb.com Deck is probabbly not very competitive but still fun to play with.

1 Nov 2016 MrHuds0n

I'm curious what would happen if you put a Clone Suffrage Movement in an OTG server and just recurred Dedication Ceremony over and over and over again.

1 Nov 2016 Eji1700

My only concern after some testing is knifed, which you can't really protect against. Its more than possible for a runner to save up and snipe your econ ice pay 20+ to break, and trash, it

1 Nov 2016 Waltzard

@MrHuds0n Infinite walls, leading to infinite money! I kind of love it.

@Eji1700 So, there's a bit of a way to block that. Knifed kills the first barrier that they break all the subs on in a run. If you are afraid of Knifed, put a "Secret Service" wall in front of your bank wall (this is generally good practice anyway for Inside Job, etc.) So you've got a str 20 Fire wall in the back, and in front of it a str 1 ice wall.

Note, Wendigo is good for this. Toss an advancement on it to make it a barrier.

None of this is to say that cutlery is an easy win. It is definitely the toughest matchup (esp. if they have D4Vid). But I've won a game or two against them.

1 Nov 2016 Exo

Do you think it could be possible to run a single Swarm in this deck? Been ages since I 've been dreaming of having it in a deck.

2 Nov 2016 Exo

Nevermind I tried it and I had it at 25 subs at some point. It turns out to be quite effective on HQ since the runner have to run there twice. Very fun deck.

2 Nov 2016 Waltzard

I'd be a bit careful about making a super swarm, as there are a decent number of things that break all sentry subs. That said, at least it wouldn't be Femme-able, so probably it had its uses.

2 Nov 2016 Krams

I testplayed the deck and had two awesome games. I lost the first one vs a Hayley with D4v1d, Scavenge and Clone Chip and won the 2nd against a stealth Kit. Kit has paid 33 to break Hadrian with Paperclip. 33! That was just insane.

I think this deck could really use a third copy off OTG, because the card is absolutely needed for scoring.

And although I really like Wendigo and Builder, having 6 out of 15 ICE as positional ICE can be really hard. I had bad luck on my first game, getting only positional ICE early (I mulliganed from no ICE to only Wendigo and then got a Builder 2nd turn).
I wonder if it'd be better to change the Wendigos into something non-positional like a Changeling to force out a killer.

2 Nov 2016 Waltzard

@Krams Ah well, nothing to be done about losing to D4vid. The reason that the deck works is that everyone left their anti-dino bullets at home. If you run into the last guy packing then you are in trouble.

Vs a setup like that you have to make many moderate walls, rather than one uber-wall, but it is still pretty much a lost cause.

Ice wise, it is a very tough call. It is true that we only have 9 ice that ETR (and, really, hadrian's isn't anything you want to immediately see), but the Localized Product Lines and Jacksons make it pretty likely that you find one.

Changeling for Builder might be a good swap. Changeling forces the killer and can do preliminary work, while still costing cerberus counters and intercepting Forked when you make it a barrier. It is obviously not ideal as a bank wall, but it might well be worth it as a stopgap measure, in case of bad pull.

The reason I'm reluctant is just the ratios. Builder is 2 to rez, 4 to break, while Changeling is 5 to rez, 3 to break. Obviously that's a bit of a hit.

Lucky that your bad draw happened vs a D4vid deck you were going to have trouble with anyway, so at least you got to see the deck work once. If this deck catches on there will be room for people to do variants that work off opponent's knowledge of the base form. IE, including one rototurret because people aren't installing killers, etc.

The reason I only use 2 OTG (as you point out, it is clutch for scoring), is that you can fetch it with Localized, recur it with reclamation. 3 would certainly not be bad. I just worry about polluting R&D with trashables, and it is mostly a dead pull once you have the setup.

Also, sometimes I build more castles? Like, I beat a Leela deck last night by building 3 remotes he couldn't challenge (THIS DECK, wtf), and scoring a hollywood and 2 oaktowns from the board to get around gang signs/HQ interface. We aren't completely married to OTG. You can OTG into a 2 hadrian's server and it is still a pain to get in.

2 Nov 2016 Krams

@Waltzard I played some more games with the deck and I really like it, it's fun to play!

I'm not really sure about Wendigo vs Changeling.

And I've also tested Archived Memories vs. Reclamation Order, they both have their advantages and you can even combine them to get each other back from archives if needed. But I guess, in the end, none of my combinations was really better than simply going 3 RO.

I also tinkered around with 3 Shipment from Kaguyas, but they're not as great as I thought. I just had to learn to trust the ID and use it to it's best. Then the Shipments became unneccessary.

2 Nov 2016 Waltzard

As far as Archived vs Reclamation...I think Interns is a strong contender. Would free up some influence.

I too find the deck fun to play, although there is definitely a trollface element to my glee. Like, this deck makes people salty, but when they complain they sound ridiculous. "I played this guy, and his deck was so bs. He put down ice and then he scored agendas behind it, over the course of 2 rounds."

2 Nov 2016 Two_EG

Gorgeous deck.

Ankusa really hurts you, so I have to find some place for Swarm anyway.

As mentioned above, Clone Suffrage Movement will be really hillarious!

3 Nov 2016 Krams

I've never really seen Ankusa in play, except for my own Khan derezzing deck :D

3 Nov 2016 Waltzard

Ankusa is a big problem. I haven't run into it, but I can totally see how that would be a problem. The deck's conceit is that runner must spend on the ice over an over, and it breaks them. If they just have to spend once, then we are beat.

I'll give Swarm a shot. Maybe a singleton replacing a Builder or similar. It would be AMAZING if I ever got it to hit, just trash their whole rig in a shot.

3 Nov 2016 Tozar

Navi Mumbai Grid deals with D4v1d, just replace your localized product lines with Consulting visits to free up some influence.

4 Nov 2016 aermet69

Navi may be a good choice. I was trying to build a version of the deck last night after reading this, and thought about how Femme Fatale would ruin my day as well. Both Navi and Underway Grids could be interesting adds. However, without Crisium Grid on HQ, the Goliath becomes much more like a normal sized person.

4 Nov 2016 Waltzard

@aermet69 Yeah, I was thinking that.

Femme: So, a Femme on your bank ice isn't the end of the world. Once you've got your engine (Dedications and Commercializaitons in archives), you can just make another one. As long as they aren't destroying your bank wall you can replicate it everywhere.

Navi Mumbai City Grid This is a hard call. As Aermet69 points out, the key to Goliath is that they have to pay a billion creds to beat the bank wall, then do it again after also trashing the Crisium. Then a third time to get the second OTG in the remote, depending on how well you've set up.

On the other hand, Navi can give you the hard lockout vs a Datasucker/Cutlery/D4vid player, which transitions quickly into victory. But it is a dead draw (presumably a 3 copy dead draw) vs. a pumpable breaker player.

Currently I'm not on Navi, though that could change.

5 Nov 2016 Waltzard

So, took the deck (-2 beanstalk, + 2 Executive Boot Camp , -3 Builder +2 Changeling and 1 Swarm to a local tourney today ( we had a pity party for "we are not at Worlds), and it ended up 2 and 2.

As far as the 2 losses went...one was very much a play error on my part. Didn't react to the Sneakdoor well enough, tried to build a remote when I should have build Archives.

The other loss was to an En Passant Val deck that used Blackmail/Dos to pass/trash ice. Got basically run over.

The 2 wins, one was vs Smoke, usual victory path of out money-ing the runner. The other was vs. another Val en-passant deck, and I got my EBC out and rezzed up a storm, scored out behind ice the runner wasn't able to break.

I think those changes are probably sticking. EBC is not only good vs blackmail tomfoolery, it also rezzes things that they are unwilling to run, so that you can dedicate it.

6 Nov 2016 CommissarFeesh

I played against this (or something very similar) yesterday on Jnet, and it was quite a slogfest for me (I can't remember if I won or not in the end, but I do know it was a close one - I think I lost).

It's worth being aware of DDoS and Knifed as a combo, or derez effects in general with En Passant. That's going to ruin your day in short order!

11 Nov 2016 aermet69

I tried a version with Clone Suffrage Movement over Reclamation Order. Put CSM Off The Grid and you can triple advance an ICE every single turn. I had a 25 advanced Ice Wall to stall him out of R&D. Was nice for Commercialization :) But it was a grind for sure. Well done making this concept work!

30 Nov 2016 Gilbod

Consider also The Twins. They can double encounter the HQ ICE in a pinch if you keep a spare copy on hand or use recursion to make it so.

Might be useful to ward off D41vd's when they come knocking.

20 Dec 2016 Robotron5673

I played this last night. Put in 2 Anson Rose and took out 1 Dedication Ceremony and 1 Crisium Grid. Had a 30 str Hadrian's Wall over HQ. Really enjoyed what you did with Weyland Consortium: Because We Built It!!!